What does it mean to provide antiracist psychotherapy? How can EMDR therapists help clients who have experienced trauma because of their race or social identity? We sit down with David Archer, MSW, MFT, who is devoting his EMDR therapy practice to helping his clients and the broader EMDR therapy profession understand what it truly means to be an antiracist EMDR therapist.
- EMDRIA members who want to learn more and earn CEs can access the following OnDemand sessions where Mr. Archer has discussed this topic (purchase required).
- References we mentioned in this episode.
- Pushout: The Criminalization of Black Girls in School by Monique W. Morris
- Anti-Racist Psychotherapy: Confronting Systemic Racism and Healing Racial Trauma by David Archer explains the general philosophy behind anti-racist practice and the mental health consequences of racial trauma
- Black Meditation: Ten Practices for Self-Care, Mindfulness, and Self-Determination by David Archer describes ten practices designed to improve racial awareness and positive self-identity with Black clients.
- Racial Trauma Recovery: Healing Our Past Using Rhythm and Processing by David Archer explores the Rhythm and Processing strategies for use in clinical contexts.
- EMDRIA Practice Resources
- EMDRIA Online EMDR Therapy Resources
- EMDRIA’s Find an EMDR Therapist Directory lists more than 13,000 EMDR therapists.
- Read or subscribe to our award-winning blog, Focal Point, an open resource on EMDR therapy.
- Follow @EMDRIA on Twitter. Connect with EMDRIA on Facebook or subscribe to our YouTube Channel.
Musical soundtrack, Acoustic Motivation 11290, supplied royalty-free by Pixabay.
Produced by Kim Howard, CAE.
Kim Howard 00:03
Welcome to the Let’s Talk EMDR podcast brought to you by the EMDR International Association or EMDRIA. I’m your host Kim Howard. In this episode we are discussing anti-racist EMDR therapy. Today’s guest of EMDR therapist David Archer. David is based in Quebec, Canada and has extensive experience working with clients who have been impacted by frictional trauma. Let’s get started. Good morning. Today we sit down with David Archer. He is a father and EMDRIA approved consultant, couple of family therapist, anti-racist psychotherapist and the developer of the rhythm and processing integrative clinical framework. He has spent the last decade researching social issues, studying clinical applications of trauma informed care, and working with clients to overcome their trauma. He specializes in helping clients who have been traumatized because of their race or social identity. Thank you, David, for being here today on our Let’s Talk EMDR podcast.
David Archer 00:57
Yeah, well, thank you for inviting me, Kim, it’s always a pleasure to speak with you.
Kim Howard 01:00
So, tell us a little bit about your journey to becoming an EMDR therapist.
David Archer 01:04
I believe a lot of it started even before I was doing clinical work. So as a social worker, I noticed that when I was working in youth protection, there were some times where I just noticed that there was a power differential that was there. I also just noticed that in youth protection, it seemed as if there were some forces causing people to be investigated, that seemed to be a little bit outside of their control. So in some cases have been multigenerational things, in some cases that just be community or systemic things that were taking place. But I didn’t have the words to fully understand that I did my Masters of Social Work, I started to understand a little bit more about systemic oppression, systemic racism. But I was still trying to find out how to help people who are going through these difficulties. I spent about five years working in an indigenous community. And there I was specializing in addictions counseling, and with addictions counselor, I noticed too, that even those these people had the substance abuse issues, we were sometimes just addressing the content of the problem instead of the process of the problem. Sometimes you’re trying to stop them from drinking, or stop them from smoking, without trying to stop the original hurt that caused the process to take place in the first place. And that was how I found EMDR. So before EMDR, I was practicing mindfulness. So I’d have some clients, and then they’d have some difficulties. I’d say, Okay, let’s practice this meditation. And so then they feel very calm, then the next session that they’d slip or they never relapse, I say what happened? And they say, Well, I didn’t meditate when I go home. But what unfortunate, how do we make it so that the effects of the mindfulness intervention that they carry forward through time, that it’s not just dependent on the therapist being present. So I started to research different types of transformative therapies. I remember using like, there were acupressure based approaches, there’s one called Emotional Freedom Technique. And I remember I was using it, but still, there were times that clients would have some AB reactions that were a little problematic, I was still seeing some interesting changes, because I that was what introduced me to the idea that talking about the problem is not always the solution from the therapist perspective. And there are some, one of my professors was like, You got to try this evidence based approach called EMDR is like EMDR. That sounds interesting. Wonder what will happen mean, Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing sounds complex. And because in my previous training as a software engineer, it’s very interested in the idea of reprocessing of the adaptive information processing model, I really took to it in the training, I ate it up. I was like, wow, this is so it’s so interesting how we were talking about memory, and the networks of memory, because as a programmer, this is, that’s my domain. So when I got back to applying that to my clients who had because at first I thought you could only use it for post traumatic stress disorder. And then I realized that some of my clients who had the substance abuse issues, it was because they were taking these medications because they were nursing, a pain that wasn’t going away. So then I realized that if we started to look at addictions, from a perspective that says that the initial injury is the thing that has to be treated, because that’s the thing that’s causing people to use the drugs in the first place. There are some changes that took place that were even surprising my supervisor at the time, he was like he wants to get trained in EMDR and their reality and after that, I still needed more of an understanding about because I found that my previous trip Oh, I forgot to say I have a bachelor’s in psychology. So my previous training was more individual centered and more focused on the interest psychic stresses that a person is going through, but I felt in working with indigenous people and also working with my own community working with because I’m a black, Jamaican African, Canadian, all of those identities are related to collectivist ways of looking at it all. And so I realized I needed extra training to get a more systemic perspective. And that’s what led me to be a couple and family therapist. And I think that that helped to refine my approach using the inclusion of Gina Graham’s using the inclusion of looking at a couple dynamics family dynamics. And that’s what led me to the Get to the point of looking at not just the individual, but the system that encompasses the individual. And that’s what led me to do anti racist EMDR therapy, and also the like, even led to the book anti-racist psychotherapy.
Kim Howard 05:29
That’s a great path. I was fortunate enough to be raised in a family with two loving parents. I’ve said this before, on this podcast, my father was an alcoholic, and in the last, gosh, probably 30 years of his life, he had stopped drinking. But that impacted me, you know, as a as a teenager, not everyone is fortunate enough to grow up in a household where you have my thank God, my mother was the stable person in our family, my father was able to he was a functioning alcoholic, he was able to go to work and do all the things that you would think that people who have that kind of problem but not be able to do. But if you happen to come from a home where you don’t have a stable environment, and you don’t have that support network, whatever trauma that you had, I would presume gets much worse, because you don’t have anybody to turn to, you know, your families, usually your immediate cushion, right. And if they’re not there for you, you don’t have that, and then that carries forward into your adulthood. And then you don’t know what it’s like to have a good supporting healthy family environment. And then if you get into a relationship with someone, you have no idea how to experience that relationship, or if you have children later on how to how to make that happen. And so I like how your path has come together it logically it makes a lot of sense when you talk about it that way. And so we’re grateful that all the people, I’m sure who your clients are very grateful that you found that path and are working your way forward.
David Archer 06:49
Well, the thing is, in a strange way, I’m grateful for my clients as well, because I have the belief that the therapist meets the clients, they’re supposed to me it was because there were times that as a therapist, I would come across some situations that seem to I seem to be bumping my head against the wall and not helping the client that the clients are the ones who would redirect me and say no, this doesn’t work. Now this doesn’t work in it lead me to go to trainings and workshops to try to understand that how do I how do I help this person at? How do we apply this to this individual, and it’s through being able to see my clients through their healing and their recovery that inspired me to find better ways and more effective ways of being able to provide care. 100 percent. I think one of the problems is that I mean, it’s a necessary thing. It’s not for psychotherapy, we move in the direction of science because of our empirical testing, and because it has to be have to have the scrutiny for our work. But ultimately, the best therapist is the one who is able to be artistic and is able to be creative, and especially if they can elicit that from the client, which is I think that’s part of what makes the work that I do successful, because I just believe everybody has an infinite creativity, I believe that when we’re children, you know, the child is able to have an imaginary friend, or could look at a wall and be entertained by a wall or or I’m in. I’m the father of a newborn, I’m seeing the magic of how the small things that cause my son to smile when we become adults. And you spoke a little bit about this, what the, you’re talking about addiction. When we become adults, it’s in the accumulation of small t traumas and large T traumas that lead to putting us into a box, it leads us to this fear of being able to access this imagination, this creativity, it leads us to fearing curiosity, there’s people who may harm us. So then we lose our confidence. We gain superstitions about ourselves and about our experiences, and then we lose our courage. And so that’s why I I’m very whenever when when I was working with addictions with people who had addictions, you would use the term recovery. And I felt that it was so important to know that we are trying to recover who we were. And in a way we are trying to rescue ourselves. And we do that by being able to reconsolidate these memories, these traumatic experiences that have been stored in this terrible way in the difficult way and we are recovering parts of ourselves that we always had. I always tell my clients we’re helping you to remember that you’ve always been awesome helping my clients remember that? Because they’re black, they’re beautiful. Instead of believing and internalizing the social ideas that your appearance is what is your worth or internalizing these ideas that’s a pending on on like your your gender, your language, your skin tone, that you’re in some way deficient. You help The person’s remember that they’re beautiful because they exist and that’s such a beautiful thing. That’s That’s what anti racist psychotherapy is all about. I want people to know that I want them to recognize their awesomeness. All people must do
Kim Howard 07:29
I have said this before as well that practicing any kind of medicine or health is not a science, it’s really an art form. Oh, for sure. It’s trying to find what works for the patient, whether it’s literally giving them medicine, medication, or whether it’s helping them with therapy, or helping them through whatever the happens. And so therapists very much have to be open to to finding different solutions for different client needs. Beautiful and congratulations on your new son, by the way is I take it he’s your first child.
David Archer 10:17
Yes, he is my first. And I’m I’m always, it brings us brings a smile to my face. Just thinking about him right now.
Kim Howard 10:25
They really change your life for the better. I will say so.
David Archer 10:29
Well, he is changing my sleeping patterns.
Kim Howard 10:33
Unfortunately, about that as new parents. Sure. You think it’s bad now just wait until they’re teenagers. But like, you are a therapist, so I feel like you’ll be better prepared than most of the mass parents?
David Archer 10:49
Well, that’s the thing. That’s what makes me laugh, because then I think I cross my fingers for him because of the therapist. I haven’t had a parent who is a therapist, like, you know, he’s gonna have these, like these experiences during his adolescence. And I’ll say use resource development installation. I taught you that when you were 12.
Kim Howard 11:06
I love it. I love it. What is your favorite part of working with clients who experience racial trauma?
David Archer 11:13
Yes. So we spoke a little bit about this before we started recording is that I think that there’s many times when we talk about trauma therapists working with other individuals, we will talk about like Harry’s traumatization, because it is really hard to be able to hear these stories a day in day out that relate to suffering that relate to oppression relating to poverty, addictions. And there’s a flip side to it, though, is that there’s some times where we also experienced vicarious growth. And so there are some clients that their stories were so heartbreaking, but at the end of the journey, they were able to fully recover. And it’s I don’t know, maybe there are studies, I haven’t looked into a lot of studies on it. But I wonder what it does, too, because we know what it does to a person to have adverse childhood experiences, and to witness violence and suffering when they’re when they’re young. But I wonder what it does to people, when continually they’re able to witness successes, and they’re able to witness the resilience of humanity. And I feel that what it’s done for me is it’s just deepened my spirituality, I just have a belief that things can and will work out. I’ve seen many people who have come into the office wall, or virtually, so they come into my into my virtual session onto my screen, and they and they have these these beliefs of brokenness. And it’s, it’s just fascinating to me that when I repeat some of their negative cognitions, to them at the end of the treatment, the they can laugh at it. But they can be like, Yeah, I’m a completely different person. I had a client. The other day, I was using the rhythm and processing or clinical framework that I saw that you were introducing anyone. And after we finished the treatment progress, they had a therapist, I was meeting with them. And the therapist said, Who is this guy? I want him to be my therapist, like they told I told them? No, that’s a conflict of interest can’t do that can’t be your therapist. But anyways, it’s really just to say that what does it do when we believe when we’re able to see that PTSD is treatable? How many veterans for all of these years have never still never even heard of EMDR? How many in the black community in my community specifically, is that there’s there’s not enough black therapists because, you know, there’s systemic barriers that even prevent anti racist therapists from even graduating or even admitting enough black therapists into into these programs. So many people don’t even know about racial trauma, of course, we experience it, and we have the consequences of it. But what a difference it would make if people knew that they could recover from these things, what a difference it can make if people knew they don’t have to feel bad about their existence. And so the best part about this type of work is the fact that my clients continued to surprise me and continue to inspire me.
Kim Howard 13:55
That’s great. That’s fantastic. So since you mentioned rhythm and processing, why don’t you tell us a little bit more about that?
David Archer 14:00
Yes. So rhythm and processing, it’s an integrative clinical framework, in the same way that I believe that humans naturally evolved, I believe that psychotherapy is also need to evolve psychotherapy is very much a young field. EMDR is a beautiful thing that has changed my life and the lives of many of my clients. And there have been some times where the therapists who was trained with basic training, where they would need to go to advanced trainings in order to help specific populations or other individual and so through my going to different advanced trainings through especially well more than the trainings or meeting clients that after these trainings, I would still get no headway. And I’d still be blocked, I needed to find out a way of being able to help them by backing on the previous experiences that I spoke to you about. So as I said, I’m a software engineer or that I was an artist. He’s also a teacher. And so through my previous experiences, and also my other clinical training that’s outside of EMDR I started to just put in things like integrate like an adjunct to EMDR. So rhythm and processing is different from other forms of clinical frameworks from other psycho therapies because as the stated goal is the elimination of racial trauma, it’s a transmutation of this specific form of suffering. So where anti racist psychotherapy is the philosophical understanding of what is racial trauma, how does it work? And also from an EMDR informed approach? How do we understand what racial trauma is, then rhythm and processing is the application of how to get there, it’s what the therapist does, so that we can have the results or example is that in because I’m an approved consultant, or sometimes I’ll have some consultees. And depending on the trainer, or depending on the training that they have received, or how they’ve interpreted the training, there’s some times where they need a little bit of an adjustment in terms of the therapeutic alliance, because EMDR should not be perceived as a cookie cutter type of psychotherapy. But some people approach it in that way that they’re trying to do just a checklist, but there needs to be a warmth in the interaction, there also needs to be a structure of the interaction, there are some therapists that try to only use a float back approach in order for reprocessing traumas. I don’t know where that where that came from it. I think it sounds good intuitively, but then it makes our therapy, more of a reactive form of therapy, it makes it so that we’re only dealing dealing with Cowles crisis of the week, every single week, there’s a crisis, okay, well, we use a float back, and we’ll deal with it in this way. But then it moves us away from the possibility of using treatment planning and actually resolving issues on a more efficient scale. So rhythm and processing is meant to solve that problem, and also to use certain types of strategies from other modalities and approaches so that we can supercharge whether it is our EMDR therapy, or other forms, but it’s also a standalone way of being able to reprocess the effects the mental health effects of racial trauma.
Kim Howard 16:55
Thank you, as we discussed at the EMDRIA Virtual Conference, what is the racial trauma target history?
David Archer 17:00
Yes, so, this is one of the components are the strategies of rhythm and processing. So the racial trauma target history is a way of being able to create a treatment plan for a client that allows both the client and the therapist to prioritize what are the targets of interest that they should be addressing. And also, it just it adds like, it makes it so that we’re more strategic with our with our psychotherapy, rather than just choosing a target out of the hat. It also makes it so that the client can be more engaged in terms of them saying, This is my preference preference for what I believe if we can reprocess this would make me consider the therapy as being successful. And it also allows the therapists to be able to say from a memory reconsolidation informed approach or from an adaptive information processing model informed approach, this is what we recommend you work on first, and then second, and then third. And it’s designed to make it so that therapy can then be a collaborative process, instead of it coming from the top down, that’s going to be a theme from many of the approaches that I use is that I’m very interested, instead of doing EMDR therapy on a client, we want to do it with the client. So we want to whenever possible, remove this, this hierarchy and make it so that we are moving alongside with the client. So when we are able to develop this list have become as equals to this list, and that we come with the same intention of trying to help this person to heal from their suffering, it just has a different type of effect, it allows us to just strategically choose what targets the client is ready for, they will see it on the computer screen, they will be able to see a list of all of their targets chronologically, and then organize through specific themes. And then we highlight the ones that the client wants to work on, we highlight the ones that the therapist wants to work on. We crossed them off the list if they have been able to be if the targets have been completed. And also through the generalization effect that happens in many transformative therapies is that there’s some times that after we reprocess targets a client, then we open it up and then the clients like nah, that one it was a priority. But now we’re good. We don’t need that one. Oh, that one too. Yeah, you know, I did speak to my mother last week. So actually, we don’t need to do that. And I think it has an effect when the client is able to see on the screen that they have been able to cross off multiple targets. There’s something that’s satisfying about crossing items off of a list when you go shopping. I guess if I can use this as a metaphor, I guess it’s a similar thing, but not really. But I think that list has helped to organize things. But there’s a satisfying thing of being able to at the end, I think that’s the goal, the therapist needs to also be able to make it so that the client can see that there’s an end to the therapy. And so, at the end of the therapy when the when the client is able to look at the whole list and see that every item is listed in orange or the color that they choose for completing the targets that the client can feel a sense of accomplishment of knowing that I have been able to survive this, that I asked that these things no longer harm me that they could see it front and center. I think that that, that also has a transformative effect on the client.
Kim Howard 20:11
I love that approach for two reasons. Number one, I like it because it makes the client feel like they’re a part of a team, like you’re part of the team, you’re not the you’re not the professor in front of the room talking to me and giving me the lesson, you and I are on a panel together. And we’re being you know, we’re working on this project together side by side. So I love that approach. And I also love it because you’re right, it is very satisfying, whether it’s a checklist for work, or to do lists for your home or your grocery list, to check things off into that feels like you have a sense of accomplishment. And it helps from the clients perspective, it also helps them organize what they want to talk about, because you know, you have conversations with people, and then whether it’s in therapy room, but most of the time, it’s outside of therapy room, you’re like, oh, I should have mentioned this, or I should have said yes. And then you’re like, Oh, I mean, if you go to therapy, and then you leave and then later you’re like, oh, I should have told David this right? Yeah, asked about that. So it’s good that you have that list, you’re both literally on the same page about what you’re working on.
David Archer 21:11
Right. And that’s that’s the goal. And many times whenever there is or in some cases, when there is resistance in the therapeutic session, it’s because of the therapist is working against the client. And that’s why I love motivational interviewing is that it gives it gives the client a break, it says that sometimes resistance is therapist initiated, not always that the client is just a treatment resistant client, sometimes just the approach doesn’t work. If that’s the case that maybe maybe it means that the therapist can be a bit more dynamic do that, surprisingly, clients want that, surprisingly, clients want humans to interact with, they want people that that care about them that also we put our training to good use, because I believe everything when when I show this to my console team, they’re like this, how come I’ve never heard of this before. And I think it’s very intuitive, and it gets the job done. So I’m a pragmatist. I’m also an idealist, you said that you’re a writer, I’m also a writer. So it means that I don’t know it means that I love to create things. And I love to just to work on the laboratory in our minds, and just put it on a piece of paper. But I also like to get things done. And there’s nothing more satisfying for the client of being able to know that there’s a beginning for the therapy and that there’s an end.
Kim Howard 22:22
Can you discuss what you mean about racial identity and how it relates to other social identities?
David Archer 22:27
Definitely, definitely. So the thing is that race is fake. That’s the first point. And when I say race is fake, because race is what we call socially constructed. So even though the U.S. Census is going to ask for what your race is, even though a Canadian, it’s the same in my country, as well as that race appears to be a thing, it’s actually fake reason why we could say it’s fake because this is because there’s some people that if they live in South America, they may be seen as white. But then if they come to the States, all of a sudden, they’re Latino or their or, or there’s something else, okay? The same thing with us is that you can have to black parents and then depending on your skin tone, in certain contexts, people will think you’re white, because if you’re light enough, then you can get what’s called White passing privilege. So that means it’s fake it means it’s something that is just agreed upon. And that sir, a bunch of people have said that this is what it is. It’s kind of like gender gender is also an interesting thing. I know in the United States, people getting mad about gendered people getting really upset about it.
Kim Howard 23:27
Overly concerned about bathroom privileges.
David Archer 23:30
Yeah, really, really angry, really angry about about these things. But it’s it just makes sense. It’s not gender exists across the spectrum is that it’s not binaries do not exist in nature. So there’s no such thing. Like, it’s just an evolution is like kind of like this progressive thing. So it’s not just all of a sudden that we just emerged as humans, as Homosapiens, there was a progression. So it means that there’s, there’s things that take place over a protracted period of time, I believe. So even with gender itself, the definition of saying that a person is a man, all of the assumptions that come with being a man, you know that you have your own house got a good job, you don’t take nothing from nobody, like these are social, socially constructed things. And then sometimes if you go to a different country, the idea of what it means to be a real man is different. That means that it’s a social construction, it means that we’ve assumed that or we it’s a set of assumptions, that is going to say what a person is. So the same thing with race. We also know that the term Caucasian is something that is it’s a racist term is created by a race theorist named Bloomin Bock. And so Caucasian is was created in order to maintain these racial hierarchies just the term itself and because this is a person who believed that the origin of all white people was or the Garden of Eden was in the Caucasus Mountain region, and so because that’s where all the most beautiful people are. So that means that that’s where all white people come from. So that means every person is a Caucasian and whoever As not Caucasian is a morally degenerate and inferior form of God’s original creation. So this person, he had the gall to invoke God in this terrible mess, nonscientific mess. And the interesting thing is that he was considered as a scientist, and even in some research articles, you’ll still see the term Caucasian to describe people. But it’s more appropriate to call a person a European American, but you don’t, you’re not going to hear that as often it’s more appropriate. You know, you hear you’ll hear African American is if African is a type of American but the the subtle, the subtlety of it is that an American as a white person, subtlety of it is not a Canadian as a white person. So it’s really just to say that is that race itself is something that was created the first recorded human that we know, mitochondrial Eve was a black woman in Africa. And so this is the person it’s just that was like more than hundreds of 1000s of years ago that this person existed. And we’re all in a way descendants of this of this individual. So I say that race is constructed, because white people have maybe forgotten that they come from the same place as black people. So if we all come from the same place, and we all have the same ancestors, this race thing has got to go. So I don’t mean to say that the experience of blackness and the experience of race is not a real consequence, obviously, an anti racist psychotherapist, but it’s really just to say that, that these are things that change with time that it’s not a scientific concept, race, it is something that we have just decided upon. Same thing with gender or the same thing with you know, like things like even a nation, we don’t have nations, Canada and United States. These are not necessarily nations. The reason why we could say that is because if you go to if you ask my indigenous brothers and sisters, are they really waving the American flag and saying, you saw the Queen passed away recently notice respect to any of you people that love the Queen, just know, that was also raining over like some of these genocidal practices that happened in Kenya. So I’m descendant of Jamaica, these these, these institutions of privilege that they’ve a lot of their wealth has generated off of the suffering of black people. So I can’t really celebrate these things. Because I’m not part of this one unifying idea of a nation, although I do have a passport has a Canadian flag on it. I’m a citizen of the world. And so it’s really just to say, I know that this is a long answer, but I think you’re used to it, you said that you’ve seen my talks, I will give 20 minute answers to one line questions. But it’s really just to say that is that we’re all family, the social construction thing that has these worse outcomes? Oh, if I can, if I may add in. So there was I think it was in 2019, or 2018. There’s a recent study in Canada talking about in youth protection cases that there are higher chances in Quebec in my province of Quebec, Canada, higher chances of black children being reported and having cases retained for youth protection for Child Protective Services. So why is it that race plays this role in Quebec in the same way, how it does in the United States in different states? And so this is something that has been decided upon why is it that poverty impacts us so so much, why is it that the that the minimum wage is set so low when the living wage is so high, so these are all policy decisions. So that’s that’s the key. That’s the key point I’m trying to make through all these different systems that I’m touching upon.
Kim Howard 28:18
There have been studies, and there’s been a lot of things will not alot news stories that happen periodically, about, you know, my children are in their early 20s, at this point, so the fact that they’ve in high school and junior high school within the last decade or so, it’s still fresh in my mind. But you know, things will happen to a white student, if a white student gets in trouble that is different than if a person a student of color, gets into trouble for the same issue. But their hammer, so to speak, comes in a lot harder on the student of color than it does on the white student. And so you see those things happening? And I you see it happening from an institutional perspective. And so you’re like, Okay, why, why did this what why did the students skate by and this student didn’t simply because of his or her skin color, and to me ignorant and not fair, and I know that life is not fair, but not the life.
David Archer 29:09
Yeah, but life doesn’t have to be unfair. It’s not the key thing. I mean, life is unfair, isn’t negative people. Life is unfair as a negative cognition. This is something that a person has this repeated and we have repeated in our society is, this is the way how to look at it. Life actually can be fair, that’s true. What I also want to say though, is when we use the term a person of color, I spoke about this at the conference to BIPOC Black indigenous person of color. They also I think, in
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Howard, K. (Host). (2022, October 14). Antiracist EMDR Therapy with David Archer, MSW, MFT (Season 1, No. 10) [Audio podcast episode]. In Let’s Talk EMDR podcast. EMDR International Association. https://www.emdria.org/letstalkemdrpodcast/
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